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Master Lead Nurturing in Marketo and Beyond

May 15, 2018 By Josh Hill

aida-model-story

Learn to Master Lead Nurturing in Marketo and Beyond

Does it feel like lead nurturing is a battle between you and the lead? It shouldn’t be. Leads want to learn. They entered your marketing funnel because they had a problem, and you provided them with insight. Instead of battering them with information, you can develop a Lead Nurturing Program to keep them engaged and moving through your funnel. According to Edward Unthank of Etumos, you just have to find the Sweet Spot where you teach and they accelerate.

Sweet Spot for Messages

Now that we have a sense of why lead nurturing is a challenge, let’s start with the basics of lead nurturing and how you can master creating this type of Marketo program.

What is Lead Nurturing?

According to Marketo, “Lead nurturing is the process of developing relationships with buyers at every stage of the sales funnel, and through every step of the buyer’s journey. It focuses on marketing and communication efforts on listening to the needs of prospects, and providing the information and answers they need.”

What is a Lead Nurturing Campaign?

A lead nurturing campaign is a series of emails that are sent based on a lead’s behavior. Marketing automation tools capture and store this information and allow marketers to deliver targeted messaged that are timed around the actions the lead has taken.

Journey Session

I’ve discussed the Journey Session in my 2016 talk, however, this is the first time I’ve gone through it in this detail. This is the top concept to learn if you build ANY email program in ANY system. It works very well with Marketo’s Engagement system and it is the basis for every campaign brief I write.

There are five steps and five questions to go through.

Five Steps:

  1. Idea
  2. Whiteboard session (Journey Session)
  3. Process Chart
  4. System Doc
  5. Build in Marketo

Five Questions: The Journey Session

The Journey Session is a campaign brief framework that ensures you have the details required to build the correct workflows in a marketing automation platform. Ideally, you bring together the 3 to 5 people (including Sales in some cases), to answer the five major questions. This should be a whiteboard meeting of 30 to 120 minutes. As a marketing operations professional, you will take the information and translate it to a specifications document with details from the database.

Question Answers What this is
Entry SFDC Leads who filled out the free trial form on US Site.

SFDC Type=Lead

Form Source=Free Trial

Who should enter this drip?

When should they enter?

Goal Paid Account

Account Type=Paid or Opp Stage=Closed Won

What’s the goal of this nurture for the Person and for the Marketer? What positive action needs to occur for this chapter to end?
Cadence/Timing One Email in first 10 minutes

1 email every week on Tues at 10:30 am PST

When should the emails or other touches occur?

Matters for how you build.

Exits – Bad •Unsubscribed

•Email Invalid

•Hard Bounced

•Excluded: Account=Cancelled OR Exhausted+No Opp

Which negative behaviors mean an end to this Chapter?

Are there people we should exclude?

Content 1 intro email

5 emails, 1 per week

Need a strong commitment from marketers to add more content or deliver it on time. Content type may influence Cadence, etc.

If you cannot answer one or more of these, you should stop until you can.

Regular vs. Irregular Cadences

A regular cadence is similar to “Once every Tuesday at 4 pm.” Usually seen in standard nurtures or stay in touch programs.

An irregular cadence is “Send an email now, then wait 3 hours, then send again, then wait 2 days, then 6 days…” You see this usually with onboarding programs or TOPO style BDR programs.

This matters because how you build this in Marketo will be very different if it is Regular or Irregular. In general, a Regular cadence is easier to build in Marketo because you can use Engagements which are simpler to maintain once running.

Engagements: Regular Cadences

Within a stream, Engagements are Regular and only Regular. You can certainly move people around across streams to speed or slow content. As a rule, though, it is best to consider these only for Regular Cadences with strong content production. This is rarely worth it for 3-4 emails that you never update or add to.

Smart Campaign: Irregular Cadences

Most of the time an Irregular Cadence means building a smart campaign with a series of Wait Steps.

Engagements+Smart Campaigns: Semi-regular Use

There are some scenarios, such as send a free trial welcome email immediately, but then sending a second email in X time. This may influence your thinking of the initial use of Smart Campaign for an Irregular Welcome and then a Regular Engagement for long term follow up.

Engagements: Launch Sequence

Best to see the slides here. Essentially, you will run a lot of batch campaigns to manage the Entries and Exits. You need a way to describe the timing of these against the Cast/Cadence. It can get complex very quickly with multiple streams, cadences, and campaigns.

Engagements: High Volume Considerations

When pushing out 100,000 or 1 million leads into an Engagement, you may want to consider using multiple streams and staggering Cadences to ensure that your email reputation is maintained. You may also want to avoid a Campaign Queue backlog with 50 nurture casts around the same time and day each week.

Struggling with Mastering Time (let alone your nurtures)?

Etumos can help with the technical setup and support, as well as improving upon your strategy and execution. We’re here to nurture.

Filed Under: Marketing Operations

When Does Account Based Marketing Hurt Scaling Up?

March 12, 2018 By Josh Hill

Several years ago, I encountered a situation I continue to reflect on. I was asked to create demand for a fintech firm that had built an interesting product on top of existing technology. As I learned more about the business they were in, I saw tremendous opportunity to make this area scalable for financial firms, and thus make us money.

Or so I thought.

The CEO eventually explained to me that he believed his market was “50 companies and 500 people.”

I thought we needed a scalable SaaS play that went beyond 50 firms. There were hundreds of possible customers who wanted to reduce costs in this area, and do it at scale. And if it were my business, I would have built the product for that scale. A company that serves 50 other large firms? Seemed limiting to me for the solution and sector we were going after.

Now there are some solutions that do only have 50 organizations to sell to. I knew a salesperson who went to such a firm where their sales cycle paid out on each stage of the sale they advanced, even if they didn’t close. That’s how valuable these projects were.

As I’ve thought more and more about ABM, my sense is that while I might have been right from a product perspective, the CEO was also right. What he wanted was Account Based Marketing. He wanted me to get those 500 people for the sales team and have those 500 people excited to consider us. His company provided customized solutions for this space, not large scale SaaS. Doing so required a completely different mindset than typical demand/lead generation I was building out.

When we think about ABM, we need to consider the firm’s strategy, the product, and the TAM.

  • Size of TAM
  • Product Scale
  • Marketing Scale

While the Product-Market Fit stage may be an ideal place to focus on that “50 Company” group, are you planning to go beyond that? If so, your decisions about the product and how to deliver it will be very different than if you decide your firm services 50 companies vs. 5000.

There are many companies that do well with highly custom solutions for 50 companies. Those service providers, however, are not very large.

I suspect many of you reading this work for companies that are building scale, or at scale, providers of a product. If so, your approach to building ABM operations will be very different than going after 50 companies.

The 50 Company Approach

The summary of the 50 Company Approach is that the small number of marketers required are going to be embedded with Sales, almost as solution consultants. The marketer will be a visionary or a consultant, and a part of the sales and customer process. Some firms will have the CEO do this instead. In this world, you do not need marketing automation or large scale MOPS. You will need personalized service.

The 50,000 Company Approach

In this large scale world, your product and marketing operations work at scale. Most marketers, sadly, will be at a distance from Sales and Customers because they are attempting to tell the company’s story at scale, automatically. This type of work provides Sales “cover” and a library of stories for the buyer personas, verticals, etc. The product itself will have a level of customization that can be done at scale with settings. Large customers will always want personalized service through professional services.

Ultimately, the difference is in the company’s strategy and the implications of that choice on operations. As long as that choice is deliberate, there isn’t a wrong answer.

Operational Implications of Strategy

Since most of us are in Marketing Operations, we are faced with the implications of the company’s strategic direction. If the Company made a clear choice and communicated that well, the business operations (MOPS, SOPS, Finance, etc) can make the implied choices well. If the Company doesn’t make a clear set of strategic choices, you’ll see that in muddled operations.

Other examples include the operations required to service 50,000 small companies vs. 5,000 larger size companies. Each side of the business will require almost an entirely separate set of operational paths and people to deliver the service well.

  • Servicing Companies under 100 people implies
    • limited or no professional services
    • take it or leave it product
    • customizations in the product
    • some APIs or out of the box connectors with limited support
    • lead generation approach would be effective
    • Email and web based support, self service.
    • Inside sales only.
    • MOPS works more like e-commerce funnel to, high scale personalization, larger batches.
    • Martech choices will look toward scale, integrations, product connection, and data quality rather than ABM.
  • Servicing Companies Over 100 People implies
    • ABM setup
    • SDR and Field Sales
    • Live support or paid support options
    • Ecosystem of VARs or Consultants
    • Limited in house consultants for largest clients
    • Heavily supported API or connectors
    • MOPS develops personalization based on Accounts, flow is more traditional SiriusDecisions model.
    • Martech choices will look at ABM more and focus more on Sales enablement.

Of course, there are plenty of options here for a company to select from.

As you progress in your MOPS role, it’s important to work closely with executives and product teams to design the most effective setup for your strategy.

Filed Under: Marketing Operations

Marketo, Privacy Regulations, and GDPR

January 3, 2018 By Josh Hill

The day is fast approaching: May 25, 2018, the first day of GDPR enforcement.

The day of reckoning for marketers who didn’t build a subscription center.

The day of reckoning for marketers who haven’t opted in people from the start.

The day your hard work needs to be done.

The good news is that this is the right time to make the pitch for Permission Marketing where everyone is opted in and expecting your message, rather than foisting it upon them. It’s the best time to allocate resources to making marketing treat your audience the way you want to be treated. It’s the right time to Operationalize what you know is the right thing to do.

This is an Opportunity to go from something you know your Marketing team should do, to one that you must do.

I want to share a few of the resources I’ve come across for Operationalizing many of the GDPR rules. Please keep in mind this is not legal advice. Please review the resources and work with your Legal Counsel to properly setup your system for Consent Management.

Overviews of GDPR

  • Understanding GDPR [Marketo webinar]
  • GDPR Summary for Marketo Customers
  • Sirius Decisions Privacy Compliance Model
  • Perkuto’s GDPR Resource Center

Operationalization of GDPR and Privacy

  • Building a Full Subscription Center – one of the key parts is to be explicit about the kinds of communication the Lead can opt in to. It is no longer enough to have a generic “opt in”.
  • GDPR and The Marketer: A Practical Guide [Marketo] – this is a pretty good guide that describes a number of key things to build inside Marketo to manage consent.

Basics of GDPR

Here’s the quick run down from what I’ve seen so far:

  • Opt-in or Double Opt In systems will be mostly compliant if you built them already.
  • Record Consent for Email, Phone, and Website communications.
  • Encrypt all systems and all transfers between systems. [Update: transfers should be encrypted, however, disk level encryption may not be always required. Please review with your Legal and IT teams.]
  • Stop sharing Spreadsheets (Use a secure file service).
  • Work with Third Party Vendors to ensure proper opt in and transfer compliance.
  • Setup rules to handle data from each Country. Make sure Marketers know this.
  • Consider using Workspaces and Lead Partitions to reduce access to “need to know” staff.
  • If you’re CASL Compliant already, much of the work may already done.
  • Event Opt In Matters – record consent!
  • Consider calling your work “Consent Management”.
  • Securing your database – use Admin tools to lock down your system.

Again, please work with your Legal team to ensure your processes are fully GDPR compliant.

[Updated: Mar 17, 2018 with new content]

Filed Under: Marketing Operations

Using Information on People and Accounts as an SDR

December 5, 2017 By Josh Hill

The purpose of the data provided to SDRs and AEs is to help them prepare for the first call with a person within a buying center. The secondary purpose is help SDRs further connect the dots of potential buying centers within an organization. Whether that’s one center or twenty, the SDR must assist in gathering this data, going beyond what Marketing can reasonably provide through tracking and enrichment.

Once Marketing determines a Person, Account, or Buying Team may be ready for an initial Sales outreach, we send the record over to an SDR. The usual process is an Email Alert or maybe a CRM Task. Then the SDR clicks into the Record (a “read” lead) to prepare for the call. 

Back in the day, just 10 years ago, I had very little information about most of my leads. LinkedIn had not yet reached a saturation point and cross-channel data was far more difficult to obtain for B2B. Thus, I would contact my leads to learn more about what their needs were and schedule a meeting if possible.

The information given, of course, varied. Inbound emails might just say “Contact me about X.” Sometimes they were more specific about “I need GDP forecast data on the 30 top countries.” Regardless, I viewed it as my job to learn more about why they needed the information so I could direct them to the right product. My process included:

  • Is the email address corporate or personal? (Indicated commitment and possible priority)
  • Look up company’s website.
  • Open Hoover’s to learn about company hierarchy and setup if needed; verify key data to see if this was a real person or entity.
  • Think a bit about the person’s role and why they might need my services.
  • Do this as quickly as possible before my competitors call the person back.

I became a top salesperson for consulting because I asked about needs and knew what was off the shelf and what was not. I took the time to leverage tools like Hoover’s to connect dots and see which buying centers existed in a firm. Were the buyers in my territory, or another salesperson’s? Were there two or three potential groups or people who would be interested?

So if you’re an SDR who thinks your job is to ask only for a meeting with your AE, you are doing yourself, your firm, and the prospect a disservice.

Today, marketing operations and sales operations can deliver huge amounts of behavior and demographic information on a Person or Account. Lead to Account matching is increasingly automated. Theoretically, the SDR or AE should be freed from mundane data entry to focus on understanding the person and buying team. The SDR and AE should be able to prepare deeply for any call.

Yet, this isn’t what I see happening.

Today, if I were in sales, I might have all sorts of signals to sort through:

  • MQL – someone said this lead met a minimum threshold indicating a call may be likely to have a meaningful discussion.
  • Lead Score – way to sort today’s MQLs from high to low.
  • Enriched demographics – titles, address, industry, likely correct address and direct dial. (no extra research!).
  • Behaviors – might see recent website visits, clicked emails, sent emails, form fills, etc. With omni-channel tools I might see other sites they are using.
  • Enriched Signals – I might also know more about their company’s funding situation, new leases, news, latest leadership changes, hierarchies, connected records we already know about.
  • LinkedIn – direct URL or view into profile without leaving my browser tab. Who is this person? What’s their experience? Are they senior? Junior? Do they write/speak about these topics? Do they know people in common?
  • Product Interest – either from Trial, direct request, pages viewed.

Despite all this data, I still get feedback from Sales that

  • It’s not accurate
  • They didn’t close
  • They aren’t ready
  • They didn’t want to talk
  • Not enough detail to call
  • Etc…

So is more information necessarily better? Are salespeople that overworked they can’t read the records in front of them?

  • Read the information on the record.
  • Look at the behavioral history, whether that’s campaign, etc…
  • Think hard. What is the lead looking at? Is there a pattern? What line of questioning or conversation would make sense?
  • Never call and say “So I saw you downloaded our whitepaper on…” It’s creepy, off-putting, and doesn’t get the conversation going in the right direction.

Here’s my advice for reading the behavior and demographic information as a salesperson:

Information How to Use it
Emails Sent SDRs ask for this, yet how does this help? I’m not sure. But, at a minimum, you can tell quickly if Marketing has done outreach or invited the person to something. As an SDR, I usually want to see if another rep had a past conversation and what it was about.
Emails Clicked A possible indicator of interest. If it’s a Product email, that may be more meaningful than a generic solution whitepaper. After scanning this information, I would take a note of topics the Lead seemed interested in. remember, no one likes to get a call where the intro line is “So, I see you clicked on a few of our emails…”
Search Phrases Search will tend to reflect the most recent concerns of the Lead. If this data is available, it may be very helpful to frame the questions you plan to ask and what to consider offering during a call.
Whitepaper/Video Forms Form Fills are strong indicators of interest in the topic area. Again, I’m looking for a pattern in the possible topics to discuss and which questions to ask a Lead.
Event Registration Showing up to a webinar or live in person event is a big time investment, so a Registration is interesting. If the Event is soon, then weaving the Event topic into a conversation is a great method. Certainly this could be a way to start a conversation such as “I’m calling to confirm your attendance and to help if you need directions, etc…” I personally would avoid the “I’m calling before the event to see if you had questions about our product.” Because it’s better to do that in person and they haven’t yet been persuaded by the live event.
Event Attendance (or not) More helpful is Attendance. Of course, if they did show up, then Sales had a chance to do a live interaction which is more powerful. As a follow up note, this information helps us prioritize the Lead over others.
Papers viewed Whitepapers are typically about solution areas or topics. Martech abounds with How To styles and dubiously constructed surveys. Again, use Papers as a way to prepare good questions and topical paths to speed up the conversation. Don’t say “Hey, I saw you downloaded Paper X, do you have questions?” I hang up on any rep who says this by Phone or Email.
Videos Viewed Ditto
Website Pages Viewed Ditto.
Social Engagement In spite of the idea of Social Selling, the reality is most Sales reps aren’t on social other than to glean data from LinkedIn. Super reps are on there, discussing Sales as well as their solution area in a helpful way. Leads may be on Social to monitor or to share. If Social information is availale, it’s a good way to learn more about the Person and recent interests.  [Link to ways to engage].
Social Profiles Helpful for preparing for the call.
Title The MQL should only send you good Titles. Helpful to verify.
Role or Level Ditto.

Know whom you’re speaking with. Conversations with junior staff will be different than Executives.

Firm/Org Name Do you know this firm? Is it in your territory? Is it already a customer in another department?
Location In your territory? Is it a cross-territory effort? Did another location buy but now you have to sell this location?
Direct Dial (or not) A missing direct dial is not a reason to Recycle a Lead. Do additional research or just call the main line. Most phone trees or Operators will get you to the right person or department. I seriously disdain any SDR who believes they deserve a direct dial every time.
Email Address Is the email a corp address or generic? If generic, is the rest of the profile accurate enough for this to be a real person?

Sometimes, regional or international divisions use variations, so are you familiar with the domain and does it match the Firm?

Marketing Permissions SDRs need to be familiar with the local regulations on Calling and Emailing Leads with “promotional” messages. If the Lead hasn’t explicitly requested contact, many countries allow fines against the company. Notifying Sales about permissions should be part of the Lead Pane, along with Training. But if someone is an MQL and they are not permissioned, then other channels must be used.
Lead Scoring Whether predictive or indicative, SDRs should understand the Score and how to use it to prioritize today’s calls. Simple systems just say “high Score means call first.” Others might be more nuanced, where the Score indicates likelihood to do a Meeting or make the Salesperson money.
Email responses If you are able to post Email responses to the Lead’s record, that’s a great way to help an SDR contextualize the conversation.
Inbound Form/Free Trial Usually an instant MQL if the Lead meets basic ICP details. Which product did they request? Is there a message? Have they used the trial yet? It should be very easy for an SDR to start a conversation with a direct request or free trial. Very important to ask good questions and to skip BS on this type of call.
Existing Relationships Lead to Account Matching and a simple search can help an SDR see if the firm already buys in another region or department. While not always needed, this is one manual area that SDRs simply ignore at their peril. Invariably Marketing will message a different department only for the SDR to realize they are already a customer. Then the SDR and Client complain about poor workflows – “I’m already a Customer” or “They are already with Joe in Atlanta, why did you waste my time with this?”

True enough…but a few moments with the CRM and a search might have told you that too.

Goal of the SDR on a Phone Call

As Stephan Schiffman says, the only goal of a Cold Call is to Make an Appointment. Ideally, that Appointment includes a basic agenda and the people on the call have a clearer idea of the meeting’s purpose.

Preparing for the Call

This involved asking a series of questions, which ideally are on a sheet where you can write some notes. Other than the obvious ones above, it helps a lot to research the Organization itself. Do you understand the history of the firm? What is their business model? What might the person actually care about?

Pretty sure we’ve all read business books where someone takes credit for a brilliant deal that was helped by a simple insightful question.

Preparing Good Questions

  • SPIN Selling and other questioning tools.
  • Can only come from preparation and understanding the business, industry, and person.
  • Active research helps you understand more than getting spoon fed. Use the basics as a jumping off point.
  • Data is not the terrain – sales still has to find out the real skinny on what’s happening inside the Account.

When should an SDR Recycle a Lead or Account?

Recycled leads are never what a marketer wants to see, but it does happen. Does Sales enjoy it? Hard to say. Sometimes I wonder if Sales treats high volume leads like candidates for a job – any indication the candidate (or lead) isn’t right is an excuse to send them away. Salespeople often “just know” a Lead isn’t going to buy, or isn’t qualified. In MOPS, it’s important to listen to that data and intuition to operationalize it, not just debunk it. At the same time, sales should take seriously that any MQL has a reason for being that way and to make a real effort to contact the person in an appropriate way.

A person (lead) may not be ready for a real conversation, however, within an Account, there could be 30 people related to your solution area. Spend some time connecting the dots with relationship tools, questions, and behaviors. Several people sniffing around your website indicates something is happening at that Account. An SDR or BDR should pay attention to these signals across multiple people.

Recycling or Downgrading an Account generally shouldn’t happen until there’s a hard “no” from the Buying Team, whether they deferred action, stuck with the status quo, or purchased a competitor. And the “no” just means taking that Account off the focus list for 6 months.

 

Filed Under: Marketing Operations

Preparing Sales Development Reps for the World

November 29, 2017 By Josh Hill

Over the past ten years, marketing operations has taken on, as one of its missions, to deliver high quality information about every Lead and Account that is passed to Sales. The perennial complaint from salespeople, especially Sales Development Reps (SDRs) is “There isn’t enough information on the lead record to make the call,” or “This person isn’t qualified” and no call is attempted.

As a former inside rep (SDR), BDR, and field sales manager, I think that’s BS.

As a marketing ops leader, I look for ways to improve the MQL experience by positioning key information at the top of the screen. Training on process and where to find information in Salesforce is also helpful. Of course, continual re-training is necessary for the habits to stick.

Good Sales Habits Start Early with Good Sales Leadership

A good Sales leader will find SDRs hungry to grow into full Account Executive, BDR, or Sales Manager roles. The trainable type, of course, tend to be fresh to the workforce or in their early 20s. We could argue a lot about ageism in SDR hiring, but this is a reality.

Young SDRs need a leader who understands habit development as well as which habits to instill

Many companies skimp on sales and inside/SDR training. Young SDRs are thrown into the pit and expected to either dial for dollars or help make appointments for your AEs. The smart SDRs read up on their job and learn how to do more than just make appointments. Perhaps you’ve noticed the SDRs who get promoted 1) meet their quotas and 2) close small deals, proving they are valuable staff.

More experienced SDRs need clear training and leadership

Whenever I encounter “resistance” from SDRs on process or information, I look to the managers to see if they are training or enforcing the agreed rules. Sometimes it’s just that Sales decided to modify the rules or try new scripts without discussing it with Marketing. Just as often I see Managers giving SDRs permission to recycle leads that “aren’t good enough.” If Sales allows Marketing to do more of the “farming” part of the role, then Sales should have an easier time finding the crops as they ripen. Ultimately this comes down to a very clear set of processes that both Marketing and Sales follow to deliver MQLs for SDR follow up.

TOPOHQ emphasizes training for SDRs because the follow up matters as much as the goal. Sales think MQLs aren’t good if they don’t close immediately, but that’s because quota carrying reps are speaking to MQLs. SDRs are meant to prepare and qualify people and Accounts. And just as Stephan Schiffman says the purpose of a cold call is to obtain a Meeting, an SQL has to be willing meet with a rep, according to TOPO.

Resources for Aspiring SDRs

  • TOPOHQ
  • HubSpot Sales Blog
  • SalesHacker on SDRs
  • Definition of SDR and another one.
  • Salesloft
  • How I Raised Myself from Failure to Success in Selling by Frank Bettger
  • Cold Calling Techniques That Really Work by Stephan Schiffman
  • SPIN Selling by Neil Rackham
  • The Challenger Customer by Corporate Executive Board

These resources come down to two components of successful sales:

  1. Keep someone interested long enough to set a substantive meeting.
  2. Ask effective questions to learn about needs and match your solution to those needs.
  3. Don’t fit square pegs into round holes. Be willing to walk away from solution-need mismatch.

Many of the more advanced sales workflow systems attached to SFDC attempt to help Salespeople follow a process, especially on questioning techniques. While I like putting inexperienced people on “rails” when there’s a tight process, that’s not a long term career path for most people.

Next, we’ll discuss how to use all of the information given to salespeople.

Filed Under: Marketing Operations

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2019 Adobe / Marketo Summit Sessions

Adobe Marketo Summit 2019

Special Content

Learn Lead Lifecycles
Speaking the Same Language for Marketo Architecture & Best Practices
Expert Guide to Program Templates

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  • Demand Generation (16)
  • Market Strategy (2)
  • Marketing Automation (49)
  • Marketing Careers (4)
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  • Marketing Technology (21)
  • Marketo User Guide (87)

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